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Quote of the day:
"The liberator who destroys my property is fighting to save my spirit. The teacher who clears all possessions from my path will set me free." -- Tyler Durden (Fight Club) |
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 MICHAEL MOORE HATES AMERICA Trailer
By Charley on June 10, 2004 1:27 PM
We featured a preview of the new documentary Michael Moore Hates America a while ago. Now take a look at the poster and the new trailer by Michael Wilson. Talentless ass-hacks, serious fools, and right-wing droolers are welcome in the discussion section.
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Talentless ass-hack indeed
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Posted by Loath (sam@aigraphics.com) on June 10, 2004 6:32 PM
I believe that Michael Moore often over-emphasizes and exaggerates facts to accomplish his goals. However, I found the trailer to be drastically unappealing. Such unimaginitive horse-excrement is only asking for another documentary production titled America Hates Michael Wilson.
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RE: Talentless ass-hack indeed
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 11:58 PM
hmm...ok well...im gonna make a documentary titled "i dont care about michael wilson, michael moore, or anything about their lives, please stop coming into my theater previews"
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RE: Loath is a Talentless ass-hack indeed
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 8:28 AM
Do the Michael Moore goon squads have to try to stifle ALL opposition? Your tearing down of Michael Wilson is baseless and just another attempt to diminish the opposition without having to address the very valid points Wilson raises.
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Wilson makes valid points???
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 3, 2004 6:52 AM
Uh, yeah, sure he does. Oh, wait, what he makes is useless garbage that rips off the Moore style of filmmaking, without purloining any of the talent, humor or original thought. Even the poster is a rip off. The guy's a talentless moron.
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RE: Loath is a Talentless ass-hack indeed
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Posted by Loath (sam@aigraphics.com) on July 1, 2004 11:21 AM
Oh, naturally I'm in a Michael Moore goon squad because I comment on the fact that Michael Wilson hyperbolizes a point everyone with half a brain knows about in a very untalented, unwitty, unoriginal style. Do you think one politically motivated lunatic is better than another? You must live in Florida.
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RE: Loath is a Talentless ass-hack indeed
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 1:07 PM
Right wingers have this knee-jerk, "YOU CAN'T CENSOR ME!" attitude because they are always the ones who are trying to censor people. You see, when liberals disagree with someone, they aren't trying to censor him, they're just saying that his movie is going to be stupid (not to put too fine a point on it). Loath never said he shouldn't be able to do it, he just said that he shouldn't have done it. Very different sentiments.
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RE: Loath is a Talentless ass-hack indeed
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 3, 2004 3:59 PM
Funny how pissy people get about this flick.
I like the fact that Michael Moore relies on freedom of speech to promote his films, ideas, and values... yet as soon as some one else exhibits such freedom (especially if it challenges him), everyone is quick to jump all over them.
You all should try practicing what you preach. If you truly love freedom of speech, and the core values of this country that Michael Moore and other propagandists so heavily rely on - then you must embrace Michael Wilson's freedoms as much as Michael Moore's.
While you can argue their messages and ideas, you cannot argue the fact that they choose to believe what they may. One is no better than the other. If we are forced to accept that one is, and must silence opposition - then we really wouldn't be American any more, now would we?
In addition, if you are so sure of Michael Moore's ideas and beliefs, than Michael Wilson should be of no concern to you.
Hmmm... I really wonder what has you all so bothered.
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RE: Loath is a Talentless ass-hack indeed
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Posted by Loath (sam@aigraphics.com) on July 4, 2004 12:29 AM
If I was saying he shouldn't be allowed to have created his "documentary", I'd be infringing on his freedom of speech. However, if I'm stating that, as an un-biased individual, I wouldn't be caught dead seeing this cheap hack of an uninspired documentary whose only aim is to dwell on the prosperity of delivering comfort to the far right wing and a temporary flurry of fame to an untalented individual, what right have you to say I shouldn't?
It sounds like you're very confused about how freedom of speech works. If you'll notice, my very first line was "I believe that Michael Moore often over-emphasizes and exaggerates facts to accomplish his goals." Never once have I, or will I, give my support to Michael Moore. Hell, I haven't even seen Farenheit 9/11, but I believe what he said was going to be said eventually, and the fact remains that Wilson, though I've only seen his trailers, appears to be a five star "talentless ass-hack".
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RE: Talentless ass-hack indeed
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 11, 2004 5:55 PM
thank you for finally taking on this bloated dilluted jack ass-hack michael moore. This guy has a brain only a dog could understand [or a leftist]. keep fighting I will for you.
Reed
minnesota
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Michael Wilson Wants To Get Rich
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Posted by Jack (jack@dtheatre.com) on June 11, 2004 11:39 AM
Following is taken from IMDB boards. Mildly entertaining and on topic.
by - MichaelReaves352 (Tue Jun 8 20:48:46)
Hello everyone, my name is Michael Reaves and I am a writer/producer from Hollywood CA. You can find information about my credentials on Imdb. I am very proud to finally announce you my upcoming documentary: MWWTGR - Michael Wilson Wants To Get Rich.
This is not a hoax, as all the research, filming and most of the editing has been completed at this point. My film production company has a partnership with two major distributors and look out for the very first trailer to be released on June 30th! We’re aiming at a Summer 2004 release in 658 theatres across the U.S.
Incredibly enough, my documentary is uncovering the past of Mike Wilson, soon- to-be-wealthy director of Michael Moore Hates America. Our team of filmmakers went to dig into his past and interview people who studied with him in school, the city he grew up in and ultimately answer what made him think the way he thinks and make his first feature film. We then put into perspective Americans in recent history which became rich and famous by capitalizing on the fame and fortune of controversial celebrities. Look out for many surprises, including an exclusive interview with Monica Lewinsky.
This movie has no political motivation. We never tried to contact Mr. Wilson to appear in it, as it would detract from the point of our documentary.
We purchased the rights to this domain, and the website will be up June 30th:
www.michaelwilsonwantstogetrich.com
Keep checking for more info! Mr. Reaves' Website
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Posted by Jack (jack@dtheatre.com) on June 11, 2004 3:57 PM
As expected, after speaking with Michael Reaves regarding this, I can confim the above is a hoax posted by an imposter.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 3, 2004 4:03 PM
Who cares if he just wants to get rich - that's what capitalism is all about.
Besides, if the Michael Moore fanatics have their way and establish redistribution of wealth... Michael Wilson's wealth and success would only lead to accomodation and better lives for the masses!
Screw working hard and making a life for yourself - that's the government's job!! Woo hoo!!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 14, 2004 7:13 AM
Man, this guy is nothing but a talentless hack who thinks he's clever.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 9:06 PM
youre just jealous you didn't think of it first. you just suck.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 14, 2004 9:26 AM
regardless, it would be a great idea.
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Documentaries for everyone!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 15, 2004 6:38 AM
I heard that George W Bush has comissioned a team to make a documentary about Mike Wilson who's made a documentary about Michael Moore who's made a documentary about George W Bush.
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RE: Documentaries for everyone!
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Posted by Skulllfire (Pocko@Argentina.org) on June 16, 2004 11:34 AM
Bush is better trimmed so that penis does not touch my face while I do the wonderful business. I love to give the sucky fun.
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RE: Documentaries for everyone!
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Posted by ThinkTwiceSpeakOnce (No Email) on June 22, 2004 3:22 PM
And Kerry is paying for M. Moore?
Everybody at once now....remember how?
"Right Wing Conspiracy! Right Wing Conspiracy! Right Wing Conspiracy!"
Man, we should have stayed with Clinton when we could have!
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I've held a cockatoo in my time.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 19, 2004 4:47 AM
I know just what you mean, I also love to regularly give my bum chum oral pleasure, Mmmmm, I wish I had a cock in my mouth right now.
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omfg this forum is so funny
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Posted by mikemre (none) on June 20, 2004 12:18 AM
this reminds me of when this rporter lady did a thing on downloaders on vcdquality and all the ppl she interviewed were such fucking n3wbs and then after everyone saw it on tv....the vcd forum was talking about how hot she was lmao. This forum is full of ppl talking about cocks and shit....just like vcd....just to say I agree with Michael Wilson bc America is being made into one big feminist/ stupidass/ opera-loving image....they tell u what racism/sexism... are since birth and just expect us to pick up their agenda....thank you Michael Wilson for having enough brain and balls to own these ppl.
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RE: Man, you is retarded boy.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 22, 2004 9:01 AM
Shut up you stupid inbred hick.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 25, 2004 3:47 PM
Love the trailer. And even better to read all the Democrats getting bent out of shape. Why don't you all take a plan to Raghead Land and get with your terrorist friends :) Read and weep suckers!
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RE: Excellent trailer
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 8:56 PM
hehehe. you're funny. but we shall see who laughs last, you global imperialist anti intellectual hack.
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I would have done it myself
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 25, 2004 8:26 PM
I like Mike Wilson. I like his trailer. I will try and see this movie if possible. I think if he is trying to make tons of money off of it, I don't care because it's for a good purpose. Moore has balkanized our society with his lies and distortions and I wish he would just shut up.
Mike Wilson has put everything he has into this documentary and I hope everything goes well for him.
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RE: I would have done it myself
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 8:59 PM
has balkanized our society with his lies and distortions:
a) George Bush
b) Michael Moore
oh yeah, a couple of real "uniters", here...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 26, 2004 6:04 PM
idiot
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 26, 2004 6:05 PM
just what we need! a documentary by a close-minded, american loving, sister fucking, gun weilding hick!!!!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 26, 2004 9:55 PM
Really? Raghead Land? So you enjoy stereotypes? Racism? Hate? Enjoy when right-wing groups try to stop a film that shows the reality of the war we're in? I'm sorry, but the last time I checked dead bodies were FACTS. Michael Moore displays the true inhumanity of war and is accused of lying. I think the right wingers are lying to themselves. Oh, and I think this documentary has no factual value whatsoever and that no liberal with their sanity will waste their time boycotting it.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 27, 2004 5:10 PM
I dont care if Mike Wilson wants to get rich, after all, isnt that what Michael Moore did? The truth of the matter is someone needs end Moore's outrageous fame/propoganda/demagogue hate America campaign. So go cry about it!!!
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left wing bitter worthless hypocrite piece of shit
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 28, 2004 6:58 AM
Michael more not only hates America, but he wants the rest of the world to do so as well. I live in France and Michael's tv shows are run here on a weekly basis. His DVD's pave the walls at the video rental shops.
I'm glad he's getting a "rectal" examination by this new film, and I hope this film is plastered everywhere in Europe as well.
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RE: left wing bitter worthless hypocrite piece of shit
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:01 PM
oh, is THAT what the palme d'or is used for? that explains the shape.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 29, 2004 12:52 AM
Trailer looks pretty good to me.
I don't understand why you people get so mad at this guy :(
I know I'd like to see it
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random bullshit movie
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 29, 2004 5:38 AM
at least MM puts humor in his movies.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 29, 2004 6:58 AM
If you can't see through Moore's "half truths", you're a sucker.
Can't wait to see him exposed.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:02 PM
really? that is the LAST thing i want to see. i like him much better with his clothes on....
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 29, 2004 9:52 AM
Michael Moore is a damn Canadian! So stop worshipping him! He is a FAT STUPID WHITE MAN! So stop worshipping him! There is no excuse, so don't even try!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 29, 2004 12:38 PM
The hard part for me to understand is how people actualy support Bush for president.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 29, 2004 1:42 PM
Jesus. I've always believed not to stereotype anybody or judge anybody, but my God are most American people dumb! I'm sorry if Farenheit 9/11 is hitting on some home truths about the so called 'War On Terrorism, George 'I'm too dumb to even spell Iraq, let alone find it on a map' Bush and your so called great America, but just face facts that, though Michael Moore does over exaggerate and stretch the facts at times he's far more truthful that some of your government at this moment. No white right wing hatin' and moaning about how somebody hates your country is going help mask the truth. No bullshit propaganda film is going to help either. Are a lot of you Americans really this dumb or is it just an act?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 3, 2004 10:38 AM
I would like to know where this guy's from above me.
If America's dumb, why is it responsible for 60% of the worlds economy, the first country to ever land on the moon, and last but not least, smart enough to create this great nation with our blood and sweat.
Yeah. Were real idiots!!
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Posted by TheFilmProphet (FilmProphet@hotmail.com) on June 29, 2004 3:26 PM
Forget Micheal Moore and his movie soon Spider--Man 2 will destroy it and everyone won't even know who he is anymore.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:05 PM
good one. that is what they said after Roger and Me. some people really don't get it, do they? love him or hate him, he is as much a part of the landscape as Rush Limbaugh, now.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 8:33 AM
The thing with us Americans is that when people for other countries criticise us we just tell them we don't give a fuck about what they think and that they're just jealous that their country isn't as great as ours. The problem is that when someone like Michael Moore starts criticising then all we can do is try to make him out as some sort of fraud who's only out to take advantage of dumb people and make himself some money.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 2:42 PM
This guy nothing but fuking scam artist trying to rip off the people, and trying to seperate them from there wallets. I dont like bush because he is a useless moron but i dont like people making movies on lies about everything.
This guy can burn in hell and so can all the liberal hippes that worship him!!!!!!!!!
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RE: moore the fat one
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:06 PM
i think you have the wrong Michael. wasn't it Eisner?
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RE: moore the fat one
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 12:27 PM
i think u have your political parties messed up! moron!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 3:37 PM
are you schitzo? what is up with the arguments with yourself?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 3:38 PM
that rocks. I am a dumbass
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 3:41 PM
dumbass = a random shemp
dumbass
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 6:07 PM
I like the filmmaker's comment in the old trailer. "You can only push the truth so far for your own benefit" or whatever it was. Yes, by all means, someone better be out there to make sure no one is pushing the truth *too* far. Pppfftt
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Original Trailer is excellent
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 8:23 PM
Forget political ties or affiliations. I for one am independent and am actually fairly soured on the "politics of politics" or more plainly, the symantics and manipulation through arguments on both sides.
The reason I liked the first trailer, was because it is the first time in a long time where I have seen a documentary actually exploring the limitations of a documentary. The last time I saw this was in the wonderful film "Stranger with a Camera." I am frustrated with Michael Moore because I feel he markets his films as documentaries, when they don't truly follow the spirit of documentaries, which is to deliver a fair and realistic view of a subject.
The second trailer has more about what a great country America is and whatnot, but I think the real power of this movie (hopefully, it depends on what the focus is) will be the presentation of how a documentary should be even-handed.
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RE: Original Trailer is excellent
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:09 PM
...which is probably NOT what this film will be about. but, i'll give it a shot.
btw- i have yet to see a documentary that does NOT have a point of view- although admittedly, Moore doesn't disguise his as well as say, Ken Burns.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 9:30 PM
I'd let Moore make his films, and the other dude make his. It doens't matter who I believe, I don't HAVE to believe any of it, they are movies and can say whatever they want, it's not the end of the world. Politics should never be in a movie medium, anyway...
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MM hates america cuz he won't talk to his clown?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 9:38 PM
This guy's movie is baseless...I happen to like Moore, and yes, documentaries are supposed to be one sided. However, claiming that Moore hates America because he won't waste his time with this kid and his camera? Look, any kid with half a brain and access to expensive camera equipment (about 95% of all college students in this country) can show up with a camera and tape themselves asking Leonard Nimoy about his underwear preference...It doesn't mean it makes for good television or film. This kid happens to be a teeny bit smarter than that 95% quotient and knows where to point that camera when hot topics are discussed. Probably an economics student at one point, I can see this guy being a great manager of his three McDonalds franchises in America.
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RE: MM hates america cuz he won't talk to his clown?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on June 30, 2004 10:23 PM
Hey, fuknut, isn't that EXACTLY how Michael Moore came to noteriety? By making a little movie called "Roger and Me" in which he threw scathing accusations at GM CEO Roger Smith, and Smith refused the interview? This kid is following your (false)hero's footsteps, and he's just a young punk? Get a fuckin clue, cockknocker...
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RE: MM hates america cuz he won't talk to his clown?
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Posted by Loath (sam@aigraphics.com) on July 1, 2004 11:42 AM
The point is that when Michael Moore did it, he was original. This poor redneck wants to imitate what Moore did...against him. If Michael Wilson ever gets rich, it'll be 100% based on the fact he was known for slamming a "celebrity" he wants so very much to become. Michael Moore raises a variety of points in an attempt to cause activity in the brains of all who view his work, no matter what their political stance. Michael Wilson flaunts a single, obvious point in a shameless attempt to discredit Moore for 15 minutes of fame and a fatter wallet.
One last point for you close-minded clowns to realize, is that the more this guy bashes Moore, the more Moore will be heard.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:11 AM
Who the fuck IS Michael Moore anyway? And does he actually exsist!?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 10:04 AM
Michael Moore Has Bitch Tits
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 11:39 AM
you can milk anything with nipples...like his career is being milked. while you are being bilked.
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RE:crying is for sissies
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 12:50 PM
Jealous!
You jealous bitches!
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RE: RE:crying is for sissies
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 1:41 PM
oh man...i totally dont care anymore. stop making documentaries and leave me in peace with my spiderman 2.
or else im gonna make one called "why i really dont give a shit about michael wilson, michael moore, or anyone else, leave me the hell alone"
....by the way the quote about milking anything with nipples, that was from meet the parents.
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Who gives a shit...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 1:39 PM
Go out and watch a good movie, like Spiderman 2 or something.
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RE: Who gives a shit...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 1:43 PM
yeah, spiderman 2 was pretty kickass....
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RE: Who gives a shit...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:13 PM
did it stop being kickass when you left the theater?
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Hey, I hope he does fine...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 3:13 PM
For me, everyone's opinion is a good thing. You see, I don't let other people think for me. I take in everything that everyone says, then, based on what I can find out, make as clear opinion of the situation myself. Nobody has all the facts.
So, kiddies, don't buy anyone's line. Think for yourself. *That's* the American way.
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RE: Hey, I hope he does fine...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 2, 2004 9:58 AM
How can it be the American way when George Bush tries to stop films like Michael Moores from being released?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 5:31 PM
in science, objectivity is extremely important. the idea is that you take everything you know, look at it from an unbiased point of view, and then (hopefully) find the best explanation for what youre looking at. true science has no agenda. unfortunately, politics, and religion, dont aspire to those standards. i would like to say, michael moore does lay out some facts in his documentry. i assume that michael wilson will do the same. i also assume that, like michael moore, he will take those facts and present his own opinion, and interpretation of those facts. those are the parts everyone should be concerned with in either documentry.
peer review is meant to regulate opinions in science (somewhat). it seems to me that criticism is the best path towards improvement, and truth, and i highly doubt that michael moore hates america, because it makes little sense to fight so passionately to change something he actually hates. also, hes not canadian.
me, im just indifferent. all governments remove personal freedom.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:19 PM
i don't believe you are indifferent, but i happen to agree with you.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 9:59 PM
In science, most research is peer reviewed by the researchers "objective" golf buddies and people put as much faith in it as other people put in religion--another bullshit line of thought.
Question everything and you will be safe. Question only the things that conflict with your sheltered world view and you you are a silly yes-man.
Every single person who thinks that the people who are for Moore want Wilson's movie shelved is somoeone who doesn't understand criticism. Every person who is for Moore and actually does want Wilson's movie shelved is just a closet Faschist.
Like most right wing douche bags.
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Loath needs to meet more people
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 6:05 PM
You all say that people with half a brain know that Michael Moore skews everything and presents things out of context. But the sad fact of the matter is, the VAST MAJORITY out there do NOT see his bias or that of the government he rails against. They simply take the side of the pundit who argues in favor of their own views. Remember, people hate to have their views altered and will cotton to those who share their own view.
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RE: Loath needs to meet more people
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Posted by Loath (sam@aigraphics.com) on July 4, 2004 12:48 AM
Once again, I must stress that everyone with half a brain has outgrown the need for such unalluring tripe. If you are one of those that finds yourself believing everything you're told by a fat man on a big screen, I highly recommend you devote a few hours to Wilson's documentary. If you have possibly been to school, or have otherwise come to meet life or reality, then this documentary has absolutely no meaning and lacks a purpose.
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And why should anyone see this thing?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 6:23 PM
I predict that people will stay away in droves. You gotta earn your journalistic cred. This Wilson character just looks like a frat boy with a smirk. Yawn.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 8:50 PM
this thread is way too long
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 1, 2004 10:02 PM
Not so long as this one. And not as full of dumbasses.
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Liberalism is default. Liberals do not think.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 2, 2004 3:17 AM
I find it amusing, and sickening that all the liberals can come up with to defend their hero, michael moore is calling anyone who criticizes him 'inbred redneck' or whatever. Then they go on to call whoever doesn't share their skewed liberal views 'racist' after making these kinds of comments. It is obvious that the majority of liberals avoid the truth. If they gave themselves the chance to actually -think- for once about the issues they protest about, they probably wouldn't stay liberal very long. These people's idiotic views would turn America into a second-rate craphole like France...
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RE: Liberalism is default. Liberals do not think.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 2, 2004 10:33 AM
What are you talking about? Liberalism as a term is used to refer to the free-thinking mind coming up with new ideals while conservatism is traditional in nature. Look up the definitions. I hate how you like to stereotype liberals as a whole as avoiding the "truth" which by the way is how you percieve the truth obviously. I am liberal but I confront the truth all the time. I've been to bowlingfortruth.com and realized his mistakes. I look at both sides and am obviously more open to the "truth" than you. Hypocrite.
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RE: Liberalism is default. Liberals do not think.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 2, 2004 10:50 AM
What you know about France is what you heard Sean Hannity tell you. It's sad that Americans think that every other country is functioning poorly and that the US is the only good place to live. I suppose next that you're going to tell me that other countries hate us because of our freedom. And you're recommending that others think for themselves. HA!
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RE: Liberalism is default. Liberals do not think.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 4:53 AM
that's funny and sadly true
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The Gary Glitter Assassinator says...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 3, 2004 1:38 PM
You right wingers who think America is the centre of the world just prove how narrow-minded and unworldly you can be at times. Any of you lot been France? Or is it too much of a "second-rate craphole" that you would just hate to visit. Maybe you haven't got a passport, or maybe you can't find France in an atlas. America is the best place to live? Considering I'm probably more likely to get shot and killed there than many, many other countries in the world. Sorry to burst many American's bubbles here but America really isn't the most envied country in the world. We all do not wish to become narrow-minded right winger Yanks. We do not get jealous when you bomb innocent civilians overseas. We do not envy your crooked politiks. We all do not wish to become obese. Get over the fact that Michael Moore has exposed Bush boy and his mugs for what they are. That other fool simply jumping on the "let's attack Moore" just smells of cheap publicity to get his ugly mug in the news for 5 minutes.
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RE: The Gary Glitter Assassinator says...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 3, 2004 9:47 PM
As a Native American, I have to agree. Most US citizens are so sheltered and so uncultured that they really do believe the propaganda about the USA being infallible and this country being the greatest place in the world. They think every other country is a police state where the people live in shacks and mud huts. Guess what! The USA is the most successful police state in the history of corrupt governments.
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libertarians are not right wing
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 4, 2004 2:54 PM
I haven't asked Mike Wilson personally but if I were to guess I'd say he's probably libertarian. Libertarians DON'T belong to either the left or the right yet they are often confused by those who consider themselves of the left or right to belong of to the "other side". Libertarians are looked at as curious and annoying creatures who most everyone would agree should just "go away". They get this treatment for making both ends of the political spectrum feel unconfortable by questioning almost all political activity comming from both the left and the right. Libertarians are congenial synics and rely on research and investigation using a scientific outlook to question and conclude their opinions. The left and the right hate this kind of nit-picky attitude and often exclude more serious Libertarian politics from their political debates.
It is almost blindingly clear that both the left and right rely on passion with minimal intellectual rigour to back their claims. They almost always feel strongly about a particular stance or point of view but will often forget why they feel that way. It's just conveniant to at some point and it "feels good" just to belong to their respective groups.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 4, 2004 3:09 PM
they attack the other side without question and without real curiosity to hear what they have to say. it becomes automatic, their responses, their emotions, and their hatred. Libertarians like to point these behaviors out and like to try and debunk well cherrished beliefs of both the left and right not to see what kind of reaction they'll get from them, but to better understand what is going on politicaly, economicaly, and socialy with the world. Libertarians are hated for this, but I would say no group hates them more then the far left. True the right complains about our being for legalized prostitution, legalizing drugs and ending the "war on drugs", and free choice to woman; but they rarely if ever accuse Libertarians of being left-wing wacko's. The left on the other hand not only misinterprets a libertarian's views, he goes on to accuse him of belonging to a group for which he clearly does not belong to and does not agree with politicaly. Libertarians are very often attacked for being "right-wing wacko's", Conservatives...we are nothing of the sort. We disagree with the right as much as you do! But your hatred of the right goes so far that you forget that we agree with you on many points and attack as, mis-label us and discard us merely for not agreeing with you on a number of topics. The left is, I'm sorry to say, more militant in their attacking, in their accusing, in their lack of tollerance towards those who do not agree with them on every issue. It's almost cult-like... They are so indoctranated (as the right could be and is many times) with their beliefs that they never question anything! This is being closed minded, this is mob-rule. I am not hear to voice an opinion on what I think of the movie. I don't care to share my views with to sides who will merely attack me personaly for my holding a particular viewpoint and not for the viewoint
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 4, 2004 3:15 PM
itself....i know this is a long blog, i don't care. make fun of me for that too. if you have an ounce of curiosity, one fiber in you that want's to at least know who the hell i am for comming out like this and saying this go online somewhere and find out what a Libertarian is. We are not conservative, we are not right wing, we are not left wing. We just like to be free to live our lives how we want to and not be restricted from this goal by ill-informed, ill-prepared, intelectualy lethargic, passionate groups. It's good to be passionate... have good reasons to back that up. I apoligize if i've offended anyone or have waisted your time.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 5, 2004 6:40 AM
You're all a bunch of damn Commies!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 5, 2004 7:51 PM
commies? dear me.
has it occured to any of you that this is really funny?
moore's documentary is filled with obvious bias, as Loath was so happy to point out is in fact OBVIOUS, while wilson's (that's his name, right?) previews look funny because of their obvious self pity and misplaced mimicry.
as to left and right debating up and down here, face facts
whatever you say is only going to piss the other side off, no matter how valid your point is.
as to the rest of this:
france is beautiful and doing fine.
and america is (currently) a shithole country divided painfully between the left and the right. Isn't this why Thomas Jefferson wanted a one party system?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 6, 2004 9:16 PM
my friend...it is a one party system....Repugs and demos both believe in the same thing...BIG business...what we need is a multi-party system...but that is not possible here...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 6, 2004 7:52 AM
Yea but your soccer team is shit.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 9:54 AM
France has an awesome soccer team--they lost to the eventual UEFA champs, Greece.
signed
-Greek-Canadian girl
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 8:10 AM
They looked pretty shit to me, especially in the last world cup.
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Just one more perspective
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 6, 2004 12:14 PM
I just wanted to comment that I enjoyed, on various levels, everyones posts on this subject and will point out that both liberal and conservative groups thrive off of any controversy. Case in point, who benefitted more when conservatives tried to censor F911? Who benefits by fueling controversy over Michael Wilson's movie? We all know the answer. I think our system is broken beyond repair and will have to crumble to the ground before real change will happen. I just don't see anything less dramatic than a total breakdown of our political and economic systems as powerful enough to change the core of these systems and both systems do have rot that has reached their core from many routes. Pessimistic? Nihilistic? Realistic? Anarchistic? Whatever you think I may be, please remember this is only my opinion and I have no more right to it than anyone else has to their own opinions. May the world, not just the United States, move toward more freedom and more happiness for all people.
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RE: Just one more perspective
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 5:06 AM
to put it in the most suttle sense:
you're a COMPLETE IDIOT!
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RE: Just one more perspective
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 8:12 AM
Suttle, ha that's classic!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 5:04 AM
HEY GENIUSES WHO THINK AMERICA SUCKS,
GUESS WHO FRANCE OWES ITS VERY EXISTENCE TODAY TO? (hint: Germany and WWII)
THAT'S RIGHT. AMERICA!
fyi, for some people America is the greatest place in the world, just as France or any other place is for others. SO CUT OUT THE EGOTISTICAL BULLSHIT, come back down to earth, and realize that
EVERYTHING IS RELATIVE!!!
(you're goin in circles)
end of thread!
------------------------
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 8:14 AM
If I recall, didn't France help out the U.S when they had that whole Hoo-Haa with the Brits? Like you said, it's all relative.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 9, 2004 6:15 PM
I cant recall anything in world history that is referred to as "the Hoo-Haa with the Brits".
And I'm not sure if France even has guns or an army, for that matter!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 12, 2004 3:27 PM
Use your imagination. Go on, give it a try.
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Gotta Problem with Canadians?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 5:10 AM
You implying that Moore is Canadian, doesn't make sense. Also, Michael Moore always says he loves America---do u just ignore that part? Anyone that supports Bush is blind. Also--one of the dumbest things people say is this: "Bush is our leader, and we should support him." What kinda crap is that? You can't criticize someone's terrible rule of a nation? people should be extra critical of leaders--it shows they aren't turning a blind eye to things.
Its not the American people that Moore criticizes, its the leadership of questionable people...and you'd have to be dumb to think that more Americans aprove of Bush than not.
Losers.
Written by a Canadian by the way.
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RE: Gotta Problem with Canadians?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 5:20 AM
You're Canadian? GREAT!!! congratulations...
but wait...
that means you can't vote!!! so, who gives a fuck about your opinion on America.
Who the hell do you think you are?
shouldn't you be arguing the Quebec independence or something!
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RE: Gotta Problem with Canadians?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 6:48 AM
Very nice....oh --so Canadians can't comment on your ignorance, eh? You know---its a shame about people like you you--so close minded. You know, there are other countries in the world....I can send you an atlas if you'd like.
I am also a member of Amnesty International, so I care about all countries and hope that their people are treated fairly....sound like you only care about YOUR county. Sounds close minded to me.
You also don't sound too smart- amusing-but not smart.
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RE: I Gotta Problem with this Canadian
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 9:16 AM
Yea, eh?
I think you should get the "Bestest World Citizen Award," eh?
Or the "I Actually Believe My Own Bullshit Award," eh?
Or how about the, "I Call Other People Stupid But I Can't Spell 'countRy' Right Award," eh?
What do you think, eh?
You think you know me, eh?
You seem to imply that you know the atlas pretty well, but can u find, "Uráturd"?
It's located in Canada, in front of a computer, reading this exact thread. A+
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RE: I Gotta Problem with this Canadian
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 8:16 AM
Ma moma always did tell me that which does not kill ya makes ya stronger.
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RE: Gotta Problem with Canadians?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 9:37 AM
seriously, "Canadian Citizen," who the fuck gives you the right the be so damn pompous and to point the "ignorance" of a great country as America!
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RE: Gotta Problem with Canadians?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 9:47 AM
I didnt say America was ignorant! Where did I say that??? I refered to the person's comments? Do they represent America as a whole? Really? Please let me know.
But then again, they are probably a Bush supporter, therefore, has no hope.
a shame.
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RE: Gotta Problem with Canadians?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 8:17 AM
It's called freedom of speech, don't you have that in America anymore?
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RE: Gotta Problem with Canadians?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 9, 2004 6:11 PM
hahaha...yea but you have to be a citizen
so not for you it doesnt, dumbass
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RE: Gotta Problem with Canadians?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 12, 2004 3:29 PM
I don't think you quite understand how the whole 'freedom of speech' thing works.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 9:45 AM
nice try man...everyone makes typos----big deal. So why the hostility?
Are you going to teach your kids the same ignorance you display here? I am a proud Canadian, and enjoy the company of my southern neighbors too. Why don't you show you have intelligence instead of trying to bully people around with your antics?
And for the last time, Michael Moore does not hate America! He is passionate about his country. Also--the trailer for the Hate America movie looks aweful....its full of cliches from cheesy God bless America flicks.
So...you HONESTLY think that people of pooer incomes feel happy about how they are treated by the Bush era? One of the Great things Moore touches on, is that when a country makes military a NUMBER 1 priority over homelessness, healthcare, education and the environment, its WRONG. You can't rule a nation with fear.
Anyway---you're not the brightest, so I guess u'll just reply by more bullying remarks with no merit.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 10:10 AM
as a matter of fact I will:
if you love Michael Moore so much: FUCK HIM!
Then, you can both teach your kids to hate America.
and I have a feeling this is the same damn Canadian as before!
You're a retard!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 10:12 AM
so what if I'm Canadian? Whats the big deal? How mature is it that u called me a retard? A cousin of mine was mentally retarded and died recently...yeah---your very mature. Again-are u ever intelligent?
Hmmm...u probable don't like immigrants either....u sound like thay type.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 10:21 AM
Can't take the jokes, eh?
Go cry about it!
looks the retardness runs rampid in your family. I rest case!
Nothing gives you the right criticize America, you should be seriously worried about yourself and not others.
One more thing, makind assumptions as to what "kind" or "type" of person I am is the real juvenile thing!
Do every one a favor and fuck off!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 10:22 AM
and my parents are immigrants, you bastard!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 10:32 AM
i don't hate America--geesh! I lived here for 15 years!!!!!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 7, 2004 10:38 AM
riiight but that would make you a U.S. citizen!
Once again, stop believing your own bullshit. It's obvious im dealing with the lowest form of life.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 8:19 AM
You love your mom right? Does that mean you fuck her?
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 11:07 AM
You are very scientific, so how about this:
Yes, I love my mom and, no I dont have sex with her, but she did give birth to me...
therefore,
You love Michael Moore, and you say you dont wanna fuck him, but then he must have given birth to YOU!
Hence, that must mean u are the ugliest thing alive!
And to bring my mother in to this is absolutely scum. It just shows that you have no ability to argue or me witty. In short, YOU ARE A F-U-C-K-I-N SISSY!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 12, 2004 3:18 PM
Yes, that makes perfect sense... In bizarro world!
P.S: 'fucking' has a fucking 'G' on the end you fucking moron.
P.P.S: Your mom's a big fat hoe and I don't care if bringing her into the subject makes you cry.
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Michael Wilson Hates Filmmaking
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 5:32 AM
At long last it is here! Proof that an ordinary guy with a computer can take on the combined forces of Mike Wilson and Brian Cartmell and make them look stupid (not too difficult, really, when you think about it).
See the Michael Wilson Hates Filmmaking website which takes the *!?@* out of that forthcoming lamefest of inept and illiterate movie making, Michael Moore Hates America
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ass hacks hate america
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 7:24 AM
Michael does hate America. Anyone that buys into his propaganda bullshit hates America too!!! Move to France you ass jockeys.
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RE: ass hacks hate america
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 8:24 AM
Ever seen deliverence? Were you in it?
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 8, 2004 4:54 PM
If your goal is the furtherance of your own opinions, it does not serve you well to resort to classic small-brained responses such as, "You're an idiot" or "What a f***ing sissy!" If you have a point which you consider to be VALID, do try to elaborate without humiliating yourselves.
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RE: Just a thought...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 11:24 PM
actually it's YOU'RE A FUCKIN SISSY!
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RE: Just a thought...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 12, 2004 3:21 PM
Are you related to George W Bush? It's got a fucking 'G' in it!!!
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RE: Just a thought...
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 8, 2004 11:27 PM
oh yea, one more thing... point proven, thanks!
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RE: Just a thought...
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 9, 2004 2:51 AM
Point proven? I assume you meant your point has been proven, but your proof seems to have eluded the message board. All that made it through was a poorly articulated opinion and a bunch of ad hominem fillers. But, if indeed you do have a provable point and the evidence to support it, by all means, share it with the rest of us.
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WILSON FLICK just cutesy
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 9, 2004 6:31 AM
It looks awful! And the title is misleading...basically Wilson is collecting some God Bless the USA stories, and not being at all critical about un-American values displayed by the Bush regime.
I hope this movie gets dissed, because from what I see, he isn't a very strong filmmaker, just a wannabe.
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 9, 2004 8:34 AM
I think you have your "regimes" messed up! Coming from a former communist country, I know that "regime" is a very strong word. Don't use it, if you have no idea what it means, to be ruled by the system and to have everything taken away from you, even your most undeniable human rights.
In America no one infringes upon your right to vote, to free speech, press, religion, assembly, etc. As a matter of fact, free speech is the reason why you and I have the right to express our opinions and not be put into jail for it. If you are an American you have the most rights and freedoms of any other person in the world. You should value these freedoms and rights and never take them for granted. Morever, the that there is a two main party political system in America, not only keeps it in balance but keeps it moving ahead.
So, express your opinion by voting and discussing it in an American manner, rather then by sending the wrong exaggerated message to foreigners about how bad everything is in America. Sure we have our own problems but who doesn't? The expression almost sounds like a wining baby. I certainly don't think that George Washington, John Adams, Benjamin Franklin, or any of the founders of our country would ever have used "regime" or anything negative to describe America even in the most difficult of times.
I feel sorry for America many times because it is so helpful to others that at times it is almost seems "naively good." The problem with many foreigners is that they are bombarded by false notions, many of which were sadly originated by Americans. Foreigners, even myself many years ago, could not comprehend that such a "good intentioned" country as America exists. I have spoken to people from Kosovo, Israel, and Iraq that are so grateful to America (I understood them not only in their words but by what was in their eyes). This is the reason why one should never get tired of saying in all of its meaning, "God Bless America."
I hope you do not get the wrong impression of my posting and merely take this as an interpretation of someone who has stood in several different "shoes." I hope you feel proud and lucky to be an American.
More accurate use:
Saddam Hussein was a regime.
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 9, 2004 10:45 AM
what? doesn't regime mean a government in power? woulnd't that make the bush administration a regime? regime doesn't automatically mean fascist dictator, you nut.
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 9, 2004 10:57 AM
dude, are you fuckin retarded or somethin. That guy is absolutely right. Last time I checked, America was a democracy, not a social system or regime!
Even a kindergartener would now that, but wait you must not have have much of an education!
you're also a loser for puttin that guy down!
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 10, 2004 12:18 AM
"Regime" is the party in power and their ilk. Look it up.
But, if we want to make it mean a party in power that takes away rights like freedom to vote, freedom of speech, freedom of choice over one's body, freedom of education, etc., I'm pretty sure we can make that definition work for the current US administration.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 10, 2004 2:50 AM
If it were up to me, you should be shot for treason!
You know, in ancient Greek civilization, they threw babies like you off cliffs!
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 10, 2004 2:59 AM
yea man go live somehwere else if all ya can do is complain
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 10, 2004 11:31 AM
Complaining is the American way. Unfortunately, so is falling into line like a good automaton, apparently. Do you want the US to be like ancient Greece? Do you want people to be shot for treason for voicing a disagreement with the government? Do you want the US to be free, or not? Your line of reasoning is completely unreasonable.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 10, 2004 12:57 PM
Complaining is the American way, what the hell is your reasoning!?!? How about working together to improve! Geez, what are you, like a 3 year old?!?!
And, DAMN, your way of thinking is so parochial, ever heard of sarcasm or wit! Dont take everything so literally, that is exactly the problem with many liberals, they cant think for themselves!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 11, 2004 10:50 PM
The best part is that my "Complaining is the American way" comment was sarcasm, genius. Now, take a deep breath and read it again, this time in a snotty voice.
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 12, 2004 7:06 AM
?!?!?!?!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 13, 2004 7:28 AM
For some reason I suddenly have the image in my head of a flea-ridden redneck sitting at a computer in a string vest scratching his head.
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 11, 2004 2:54 AM
First, the word "regime" may be defined by Webster as nothing more than a governing political unit, buch such a benign usage hardly applies today. In today's world, the word is typically reserved for oppressive governments and usually implies fascist, dictatorial political systems.
Second, America is not a democracy, but rather a republic. The difference between the two is that in a pure democracy, the people have no representatives, and any decisions made with regards to the government are decided by a "majority rules" vote. In a republic, however, the people vote for representatives who, in turn, cast votes in government decisions (i.e., bills, amendments, etc.) The important distinction between a democracy and republic, which few Americans understand, is that while a representative casts a vote based on a democratic-style, "majority rules" vote by the people he represents, it is possible that the vote may have a different outcome than the same vote in a democracy; for example, the presidential elections of 2000. The Electoral College system is set up so that each state is worth a certain number of votes, based on population. When the people vote for the ticket of their choosing, the votes are tallied and the ticket which recieves the most votes (by democratic, "majority rules") recieves all of the electoral votes for that state. Ergo, as with the election in 2000, it is possible that a majority of the American voters will vote for one ticket, but the opposition wins because it is the electoral vote which counts, NOT the popular vote. In a democracy, the winning ticket would simply be the one which wins the popular vote.
Finally, to say that the current administration is impinging on the American people's right to vote is asinine. I'm not even sure how you can arrive at the conclusion that the Bush White House is threatening your right to vote or freedom of speech. As far as education is concerned, I'd like to know where in the Constitution education is stated as a right of the American people. It is a privilege, not a right. And freedom of choice over one's body? I assume you refer to the issue of abortion. The claim that a woman has a "right" to abort her unborn baby hinges on the definition of when the fetus become a human life, which in turn defines whether or not abortion is murder. Unless we are prepared to argue that topic, I suggest we not delve into whether or not this administration is fighting to deny our rights to our own bodies.
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 11, 2004 12:31 PM
dude, WHAT ARE YOU SMOKIN?!?! If that isnt the stupidest mumbo-jumbo I have ever heard in my life, I don't what is!
seriously, what has infested your brain and where are you researching?!?! Regime? Republic? Are you on the right page of your text?
First of all, the falicy of the "regime" notion has been explained to you before so stop trying too hard with that one (plus your contradicting yourself). Second, the theory that America was founded as a republic is a notion among conservatives, hence the word "republican." That is how I know you fucked up with your research! Moreover, it has VERY little to do with our PRESIDENTIAL electoral system today. Certainly has NOTHING to do with the crap you wrote! If ya don't believe me, take it to any political science professor, but be advised, they might laugh at you!
Third, where the hell did you get the topic of "abortion." Lay of those drugs and take some political science classes instead! Your probably refering to what the immigrant guy wrote about "undeniable human rights." Anyone with half a brain knows what that is, its in our Consitution too called our "inalienble rights"! READ IT, I have no time to tutor you!
Education?!?! privilege not right? great! Think what you may on that topic but I dont give a flying fuck! Again your on the wrong page! I only implied that you need an education before you decide to lecture others.
When I said liberals cant think for themselves, your response was to frantically research what other people thought (dont deny it, cuz you're only kiddin yourself)! My theory attested, most liberals can't think for themselves!
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 11, 2004 3:14 PM
1. "The falicy of the 'regime' notion" has not been explained, certainly not by you. The fact that you said the Bush administration is a regime is not an explanation, just a poorly supported opinion.
2. I didn't contradict myself, and I'd like to know where in my post you think I did.
3. Before you get your emotional panties in a wad, look up the definitions of "republic" and "democracy." A democracy has no head of state, such as the President, but it may have representatives to represent the people. A republic must have representatives, and does have a non-monarchic head of state, such as the President. Athens was a democracy, my friend. The United States is a republic. Go back and read the Pledge of Allegiance if you're unsure; it doesn't say, "and to the DEMOCRACY for which it stands."
4. This has nothing to do with believing you or not believing you. It has to do with me being right and you being wrong.
5. When I commented on abortion, I was attempting to interpret what you said about the current administration trying to take away "rights like ... freedom of choice over one's body." If you weren't referring to abortion, please expound on what you DID mean, because you did a poor job of it the first time.
6. The only "inalienable rights" which the Constitution guarantees you are the right to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." These are rights which the founding fathers felt every human being is entitled to. The rest of the rights you inherit as an American are not inalienable, but are part of the blessing of living in the country we do. That said, it doesn't give any weight to your argument about the Bush administration trying to take away your right to your own body.
7. If you can find for me in the Constitution where you, as an American, are guaranteed an education, I will stand corrected and pat you on the back. And no, you weren't just implying that you need an education before lecturing others. Go back and read your own post, you accused the Bush White House of trying to take away your right to an education (which, shockingly enough, is asinine).
8. I wasn't responding to your comment about liberals not being able to think for themselves. I'm not a liberal, I'm a conservative, and if you can't tell that from my posts, you need to speak less and listen more.
9. Strangely enough, YOU are presenting the liberal side of this argument. And I agree, most liberals can't think for themselves, the reason being that they are the product of a public education system which, year after year, graduates mediocre students.
10. If your goal is to convince people that you are right, try using valid explanations instead of emotions and profanity. And, by the way, I didn't have to research anything to respond to your claims. The holes in your argument are big enough to walk through, and require very little effort to refute.
I predict that your response to these claims will sound something like, "Dude, are you f***ing stoned?!?!" or perhaps something as articulate as "Whatever, man, you're just a right-wing a**hole." It's what we've come to expect from you.
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 11, 2004 10:45 PM
He didn't write the post you were responding to. I have no idea what he is talking about because nobody (including me) logs in, so we have no idea who is responding to whom except by where the posts are located and (to a certain extent) what their contents are.
So to respond.
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is such a vague notion that I doubt we should start trying to use it to argue. But if you insist. Two-thirds of that list might include education if you are a person who wants an education to further your happiness, which most people do. It is also arguable that life is better with an education. That said, you never refuted the idea that the Bush administration is laying waste to our education system, so I'll concede. The Constitution does not specifically say "education." I just take education as one of the things that is implied.
Arguing about abortion is like arguing about which color is nicer, blue or green. But the Supreme Court has long upheld the right "to choose," and our system of law works in that specific way. Based on the way it is spelled out in The Constitution.
I am representing the side of reasonable ideas, once you give them some thought.
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 12, 2004 12:30 AM
Thanks for clearing up the issue of who is writing what. I figured that either there was a flaw in the log-in process, or I was dealing with a schizophrenic.
I would disagree that a right to an education is included in "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" based on qualifying word, "pursuit." I completely agree that life is better with an education, but I don't believe that we are owed an education by the government. The above phrase simply means that we are guaranteed the right to pursue happiness, but not handed happiness on a silver platter, nor are we guaranteed to be supplied with all the tools we need to attain it. I believe that the phrase simply means that the government/citizens of this country cannot prevent or otherwise attempt to sabotage our life, liberty, or pursuit of happiness. So, as you said, education is not specifically mentioned in the Constitution, but we simply disagree on whether or not it is implied.
Being, as I am, a conservative, I do not share the opinion that Bush is damaging our education system. I believe, and I think statistics would be helpful here, that the public education system has been foundering since long before Bush's administration took office. I agree with Bush's position that throwing more money at an already inefficient education system is not the answer to the problem; ergo, I did not address Bush's "laying waste" to the system. I just don't feel that he is, that's all.
I agree that the debate over abortion is, on a certain level, as "piddly" as debating color choices. I think that the root of the argument is over when the fetus becomes a human being. As you said, the courts have for decades sided with those who believe that the fetus is not a human life until birth, and is therefore not entitled to a right to "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." I think you will agree that this is the watershed issue concerning abortion.
Perhaps we should all make sure to sign in, just so we know who we're talking to. But, I appreciate whoever it is who responded to my last post. It was refreshing to read some solid logic and dialogue void of expletives and personal attacks. Log in next time so I know who I'm talking to :)
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 12, 2004 10:58 AM
Yes, the education system is in ruins and I don't blame the current administration. At this point it is probably impossible to point fingers on that issue. Suffice it to say that it is a societal problem and not a conservative vs liberal problem.
And throwing money at an inefficient system is the absolute worst thing citizens can do. We legitimze inefiecency when we vote for the party, not for the issues. Unfortunately, as the well-spoken person below (sarcasm intended) points out, many US citizens feel that there has to be a divide, whether it is ideological, financial, or whether your favorite animal is an elephant or donkey. Makes no sense, but there it is.
And "no child left behind," whether for good intentions or not, is laying waste to the education system. My penchant for hyperbole doesn't take away from the implications of a system that puts a premium on biased testing and vocational, rather than life skills.
Thanks for engaging in a conversation, rather than a screaming match. Although, the screaming matches are good for page hits (I am the author of the above article, where all these lively debates are taking place. I don't like to log in because every time I do my spam rate doubles since my email address is displayed after the login.)
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RE: God Bless Our America!
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 13, 2004 12:05 AM
I agree with your comments about the state of the education system, but I'm not sure I completely understand the logic behind your statement, "We legitimze inefiecency when we vote for the party, not for the issues." For my own sake, I vote for the party based on the party's position on certain issues.
I also agree that the practical applications thus far of the "no child left behind" mentality are lacking, though I think the effort is a step in the right direction. The problem I have with the testing is that, while standards are necessary, improper implementation simply fosters the attitude of "pass the kids or the school loses funding."
Agreed, a rational discussion is preferred over a screaming match. Is there any way you can remove your email address from your login profile? I'd really like to know how many people I'm talking to. Sorry about the double post below.
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God bless everyone!
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Posted by Charley (molar_bullets@yahoo.com) on July 13, 2004 11:00 PM
I can't change my login email because I'm an admin. Oh well, a few viagra ads never hurt anyone.
What I meant about "voting for the party" is that democrats, republicans, libertarians, socialists, et al. vote for "their guy" based mostly on what the generic representation of what the party's issues are. So, for example, this November a bunch of democrats will vote for Kerry even though his politics are not exactly what they're looking for. It's the better of two evils. Granted, I am guilty of the same thing because there is no elected official that will satisfy everyone to 100%, but it would be nice if Kerry at least had a few of the things that I am looking for. It's the problem of living in a Republic, I suppose.
But, like Moore says (one of the few things I agree with him about [and to tie this conversation back to topic]) I would rather have a president in the office telling me he is going to fuck me over, rather than one who is in the office giving me the thumbs up with one hand while the other hand is feeling up my girlfriend. Hypothetically speaking. So voting is tough for me because there is no really good choice. No plausible one, at least. I think that is many people's problem.
My bone with Michael Wilson is that he is not doing something that I see to be entertaining. While I don't agree with his politics, I am also a writer and a movie fan who wants to watch interesting things. Moore is seriously misguided, but at least he is somewhat interesting.
I have given Wilson the chance to prove my intial asessment wrong and there's a 50/50 chance that he will be sending me an advanced copy of the movie for a review. I promised him an unbiased viewing, something I intend to follow through with considering some of the things I wrote about him and how well he took it. (He was a very nice guy in our brief correspondance. I can't imagine Moore being so friendly to a journalist who just compared him to a Backstreet Boy, or Meatloaf, or whatever the analogy would be.)
And you're absolutely right: beside flawed testing, the most glaring problem with "no child left behind" is the funding based on testing. That was what I was alluding to in the last post, although sometimes I come across as incomprehensible. That's why I have an editor. That and to add curse words to my article if I've forgotten to. You have to love dTheatre. The ad I responded to for the job said "Swearing is encouraged." When I offer clips from the site to other venues, I have to be careful what I select.
Boy I'm rambling. Thanks everyone for your interest in this article and your lively debates here at dTheatre. If you have any questions or comments, feel free to send me an email. I try to respond to every single one.
charley
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 9, 2004 8:14 AM
Liberals are very happy and completely out of touch with reality.
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Better go to a Doctor!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 12, 2004 7:02 AM
Dear Schizophrenic person(s) who has written about three pages of thread in one day pretending to be someone else and was the original founder of the “regime” notion:
You are a TOTAL AND COMPLETE WASTE of not only my time but of the all of the other people who make at least coherent points. It is almost inconceivable to me that someone as misinformed as you has the guts to keep responding! Furthermore, I think you have a serious problem of sending messages to yourself as different people? Who’s who is: they are all you! And nothing was cleared up by any of the threads! You know very well who I am and most of the threads I have posted! (hint: I was born in the U.S.!)
As for your political status, I highly doubt that your fanatical anti-Bush and anti-American system remarks would make your anything other that an EXTREMIST LIBERAL! You have said absolutely nothing that would even hint towards being a “right-winger”. So, what the in the world are you talking about? Whatever the case, I am sure that even liberals would be ashamed to call you one of their own. I mean, DAMN, you don’t even know what you YOU ARE! “Know thyself above all”
So, as my final advice to you to stop making a fool of yourself, take some political science classes and for everyone’s sake, make up your mind about what the hell you are! Plus NO ONE ELSE EVER DISCUSSED THE TOPICS OF EDUCATION OR ABORTION EXCEPT FOR YOU! That’s it, just keep arguing with yourself!
I should really start charging for your tutoring and psychoanalyses! STOP FOOLING YOURSELF! And if you are still possessed then, WRITE AS MUCH AS YOU WANT, I assure you no one will care (except perhaps your “other halves”)!
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RE: Better go to a Doctor!
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 12, 2004 11:46 PM
I can't tell who you're referring to. You mentioned the schizofrenic, so that leads me to believe you are talking about one of the people posting under "A random shemp," but you also mentioned the issues of education and abortion, which I discussed. Please specify.
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RE: Better go to a Doctor!
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 12, 2004 11:48 PM
I can't tell who you're referring to. You mentioned the schizofrenic, so that leads me to believe you are talking about one of the people posting under "A random shemp," but you also mentioned the issues of education and abortion, which I discussed. Please specify.
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RE: Better go to a Doctor!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 13, 2004 7:30 AM
I'm a random shemp? WTF!!?
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RE: Better go to a Doctor!
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 13, 2004 2:44 PM
Read the name you're posting under.
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RE: Better go to a Doctor!
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Posted by A random shemp (No Email) on July 14, 2004 7:54 AM
Parsley? WTF!!?
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RE: Better go to a Doctor!
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Posted by Parsley (No Email) on July 14, 2004 4:59 PM
Forget it. Stick to less complicated issues.
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